Cut.
Chop.
Butcher.
And let it grow.
Repeat. Again and again.
Seriously, is this the only way, or is it the fastest way?
Take a look:
adamaskwhy.com/2017/05/12/chop-chop-chop...chnique-or-butchery/

Clicio wrote: Cut.
Chop.
Butcher.
And let it grow.
Repeat. Again and again.
Seriously, is this the only way, or is it the fastest way?
Take a look:
adamaskwhy.com/2017/05/12/chop-chop-chop...chnique-or-butchery/

What would you do with a tree like maple or oak? how else would you develop the trunk?. It shouldn't be fast, after the chop is where the hard part begins, otherwise you'll end up with some random looking fat plant.

Clicio wrote: Cut.
Chop.
Butcher.

The guy likes to use strong words. Doesn't mean this is not a proper technique. It is.

Seriously, is this the only way, or is it the fastest way?

It is not the only way, but you knew that. I'm sure you have read LB's article about it, or else the article on this website.
If it's the fastest way? Does that matter? Bonsai is not a race. Is it good advice for beginners? I don't know - it's a good advice for people with patience (and actually, all other techniques require patience too).

Take a look

I already know the article - and many others about this technique.

Auk wrote: If it's the fastest way? Does that matter? Bonsai is not a race.
Is it good advice for beginners? I don't know - it's a good advice for people with patience (and actually, all other techniques require patience too).

Exactly. It is not a race, so any useful technique and lots of patience can bring the future rewards.
For beginners is a way to demonstrate bonsai can not be bought ready-made in malls, and the fun part is planning, executing and waiting.
Oh, BTW, yes, you're right. I have read this and many, many other articles about cut and grow. Clip and wait. Yamadori. And came to the conclusion mallsai ficuses have a role in this play: they are helpful teaching people they are not really bonsai as the label says, and they don't die easily even with all the mistakes beginners will do to them.

Clicio wrote:

Auk wrote: If it's the fastest way? Does that matter? Bonsai is not a race.
Is it good advice for beginners? I don't know - it's a good advice for people with patience (and actually, all other techniques require patience too).

Exactly. It is not a race, so any useful technique and lots of patience can bring the future rewards.
For beginners is a way to demonstrate bonsai can not be bought ready-made in malls, and the fun part is planning, executing and waiting.
Oh, BTW, yes, you're right. I have read this and many, many other articles about cut and grow. Clip and wait. Yamadori. And came to the conclusion mallsai ficuses have a role in this play: they are helpful teaching people they are not really bonsai as the label says, and they don't die easily even with all the mistakes beginners will do to them.

Really? I think mallsai get murdered all the time. You can still practice things like branch development, repotting, and etc... with cheaper trees (nursery grown, mallsai is actually expensive for what it is). I personally believe there is nothing wrong with buying cheap nursery material with meh trunks, and mediocre potential, to practice and learn. So when you get the nice Yamadori, or the more expensive developed tree, yo don't mess it up. Also, making meh material, into nice material is a good challenge. Heck I have a ton of those.

But I think mallsai is a waste of time and money.

eangola wrote: Really? I think mallsai get murdered all the time.

You have spent some time on the forum and you will have noticed the sheer amount of people that really have no idea about what they bought.
These people often say they are interested in bonsai, but usually, actually, they are not. They have not done any reading on bonsai, do not know what the species is they bought, sometimes even don't have much experience with house plants, don't know that bonsai belong outdoors (and that there are only a few that survive indoors), and once someone even said he wasn't interested in the art, but just wanted a decorative plant for his office.

That's what these mallsai are intended for. See it like buying flowers. They look kind of nice (if you do not look at them like bonsai) and they are not meant to last.
It's two different worlds. People coming here to really learn about bonsai and that want to share with others, and the massive amount of people that just want a decorative plant for indoors.

You can still practice things like branch development, repotting, and etc... with cheaper trees (nursery grown, mallsai is actually expensive for what it is)

Sure, but that takes time to study, learn, practice, training, talent, and that was not what these people were expecting or even looking for.

But I think mallsai is a waste of time and money.

For a lot of people, yes. People who buy it without any idea about bonsai, want to repot/prune/wire/shape it without learning how to do that first, killing the tree in the process, it is a waste of time and money. However, we have seen what Kristoff can do with mallsai

I have written about this often. There are two opinions:
- Mallsai are a curse for the bonsai community, they give bonsai a bad name
- Mallsai are a blessing for the community, they introduce lots of new enthusiasts to bonsai, by offering cheap material

I obviously tend to agree with the first statement. From the hundreds of new people on this forum, that purchased a mallsai, only a very few stick around. That is NOT because they get condescending replies, it is because they did not expect what bonsai really is about.

Sources:
Bonsai, the bane of the bonsai community:
forums2.gardenweb.com/discussions/137623...the-bonsai-community

In defense of the mallsai:
artofbonsai.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=2346

From that article:

"They are quickly and inartistically shaped to resemble an image that the general public would recognize as a bonsai¨

Well, that is one of the problems isn't it? Trees should not look like bonsai, bonsai should look like trees.

eangola wrote: Really? I think mallsai get murdered all the time.

Auk wrote: However, we have seen what Kristoff can do with mallsai

- Mallsai are a curse for the bonsai community, they give bonsai a bad name...
I obviously tend to agree with the first statement.

Yes, I see both eangola and Auk's reasoning. IF you are thinking about learning bonsai, a nursery boxwood makes more sense.
BUT... IF one already bought/got a mallsai as a gift , then why not use it for training? There is Kristoff, of course, and others that transformed mallsai into something decent as a bonsai. So, there is hope. Yes, I am not being realistic...