tubaboy wrote: ok. I read something about this in the book I have also. But that's an important difference. I'll look around for it too, but is it normal that the candle would push out a second set of needles after the first set is completely out?

Erm.... I'm confused. My white pines don't do that
Mugo's I have no experience with. Also, it would not push out a second set of needles, but a set of buds (that form needles, so maybe that's what you meant).
As far as I know they're single flush though (but I'm not sure now, guess I'm going to have to Google that )

It is the mugo that's doing that I'll take a picture tomorrow when its light outside again.

here is a link about it: www.bonsai4me.com/AdvTech/ATMugo%20Pines%20Indepth%20page2.html

tubaboy wrote: here is a link about it: www.bonsai4me.com/AdvTech/ATMugo%20Pines%20Indepth%20page2.html

I read that

Not fully clear though, they mention 'first flush of growth', so that seems to indicate there's a second flush. However, it should be pinched, apparently not decandled, and that generally is the advice for single flush pines... I need to Google more

Here's what they look like.

Could be a late bud developing, maybe it was already there.

Decandling a single flush pine like a dual flush one will give serious problems.
Pinching a dual flush pine like a single flush one will not (though it may not suit your development plans).

So, I guess it is safe to assume it is single f lush for now, and check next year whether it does, or does not, develop a second set of buds after the first flush.

definitely better to error on the side of caution. You're right there.

What's interestin is that the set of green needles in the middle is coming out of the side of what was a candle at the beginning of the season. it wasn't there at all a few weeks ago.

I'm sure this is natural for this type of pine. But I wasn't ecpecting this either.